Dr Brian Goldman, an emergency physician at Toronto's busy Mount Sinai Hospital, somehow finds time in between ER shifts for a second job as a CBC radio host. His show, , airs Mondays at 11:30am and Fridays at 8pm on CBC Radio One. He also maintains a to accompany the show and appears on other CBC programs as the in-house medical columnist.
He took a few minutes out of his day, after already putting in a few hours in the Mount Sinai emergency department, to speak to us from the CBC's head office on Front Street in downtown Toronto, where he was revising some radio scripts.
First of all, how did the show get started?
I started to put together a proposal for a book called Medical BS. I sent it off to a bunch of publishers and they told me it was way too negative. Back to the drawing board. I had been a medical columnist for CBC for years, the health expert on afternoon shows. So I put together a proposal on the same idea -- what is true and what is BS. A producer, Quade Hermann, came back and said, “We’re not saying yes and we’re not saying no.” They said it needs work, it’s still too negative. We had meetings and one producer, Quade Hermann, kept asking, What is the black art of waiting rooms? What is the black art of waiting for surgery? Black art this, black art that. Doctors running around in white coats practising black art -- that’s how we got the title. Listeners want to understand why things work the way they do. They don’t want to complain anymore. As an emergency physician, they want to walk a mile in your shoes. What does it feel like? What is like to navigate through 10 patients, working in emerg, with nurses and everybody needing my attention at the same time? I pitched it two years ago and got funding, revised the proposal and made a pilot with Quade Hermann, which took about six months. That sat with the poobahs at CBC for six months and they came back and said, “Let’s make some episodes.” That was the happiest day of my life. It’s my show. It’s the most personal show I have ever done, and it’s the most fun for that reason. I get to do things and deliver commentary like I never have been able to do before. I’m lucky -- most hosts don't get to do what I’ve done. I feel incredibly fortunate to have this show on the air now. It comes at a perfect time in my career, at a quarter-century in broadcasting. I couldn't have done it ten years ago, but it’s perfect now.
Does your show have a lot of physician listeners?
We don't have exact surveys but we get a ton of physicians, family docs, specialists, nurses, pharmacists who listen -- all kinds of health professionals. And it’s not just individuals, but organized medicine too. We get emails from conferences, colleges of physicians nurses, schools, and universities.
What kind of feedback do you get?
Lots of suggestions for topics and lots of tips on how to fix the healthcare system. We have had [letters from] a number of people who have qualified to practise in other countries, like in the United States, who tried to get their licenses here but have gone back to the States and have opinions on what regulators should do. When we touch a raw nerve we hear about it. We did a show on physician competence, and we heard from them. We did a show on nurse competence, and we had a panel where nurses talked about newbies, new grads. And boy did we hear from the new grads. They said it’s a culture of eating their young. That really showed me people are listening.
Which subjects are the most popular?
Any story that gets inside the world of medicine and tells the story from the standpoint of the doctors and nurses. Any story that deconstructs for patients why they wait in the emergency department. We had an interview with a couple of triage nurses from the Peter Lougheed Centre in Calgary; they talked about the really incredibly difficult job triage nurses have, when they have 70 or 80 people or more waiting, eyeballing them. These nurses told some amazing stories of why they love it, what makes them frustrated -- the incredibly difficult job they do. We got a ton of people talking -- some good, some bad, some laudatory, some critical. What we are looking for on the show, as a colleague, a producer of a long running show on CBC Radio One, told me, is anger and understanding. That is the sweet spot. We want you to be a little peeved when you hear the inside story, but want you to understand what's going on.
Has anything else hit a nerve lately?
We did a show on queue jumping, how to be a successful queue jumper, and we opened with a Seinfeld episode -- the one where George and Jerry and Elaine are waiting at the Chinese restaurant and everybody is getting in ahead of them. This show gives me the license to pick from pop culture, music and Grey’s Anatomy and House. In fact, we devoted a half a show to whether a real-life House would be able to practise medicine in the real world.
What did you decide?
Probably 10 or 15 years ago he would have been able to, but now that doctor would be put out on his ass pretty quickly. I’ve heard of a surgeon who flung scalpels at OR nurses. You’re not allowed to do that anymore.
Do you try to target any of your content to physicians?
Of course, our primary audience is people who are health consumers, who are interested in understanding how the system works, not judging it but understanding how to get a little more out of the system, the code words to say to a doctor or a nurse to get more than they are getting now. But the amazing thing is the reaction from health professionals. When we hit the mark with consumers, we hit the mark with health professionals.
Do you listen to other radio programs for doctors?
One qualification: there are no similar shows to our show. There are none. What i have found -- with all due respect to health reporting and health commentary -- is that they tend to be advice. The only place you could get this kind of show is on CBC or on NPR in the US. There’s no other place to get documentary-style programs. I think the other shows serve a purpose -- you get questions you can ask your doctor, or whether you should be worried about something or not. I have been a health columnist on CBC radio for years and I hope that serves a purpose, but this venting, cathartic program is absolutely unique.
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